|
|
Author |
Message |
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#1 Posted: 23 Mar 2007 02:34 pm Post subject: Optimized MF Hammerdin Build |
|
|
First of all, you may be thinking: "why a hammerdin? hammerdin doesnt achieve high mf without becoming totally gimp! I want to make a sorceress for mfing"
Many people live under the delusion that a hammerdin cannot achieve high mf at all and will become totally gimp if it tries to do so. However, one of the best mf spots of all time, the chaos sanctuary, can prove a nightmare for any sorceress, with element immunities left and right and iron maiden to kill the precious infinity merc. However, with this build, you can chaos with ease and still find great items.
Of course needless to say you should lvl to 85-ish before you spend any stats then put just enough str to wear your gear and just enough dex to achieve maximum block; and for skills you should put in points to all the normal hammerdin skills (max hammers, vigor, blessed aim, concentration, 1 into redeption, 1 into all prerequisites, rest into holy shield etc).
Using this setup, the hammerdin hits 550-600 mf and still has 80% fcr (enough for the 75 breakpoint), max block, 3k life, and 10k hammer damage (which is enough to kill almost all monsters in 2 hits anyways in a one player game). Remember that having high mf is only relevent if you are the one getting the last hit, so most of the time you will be in a game with few players. Of course notice that if you were truly devoted you could craft an ammy with stats, 5% or more fcr, and mf, and achieve even more mf by replacing the fcr ring with another nagel, but I haven't seen any ammies fitting that description so far and use a 10% fcr ring with mf instead. Now it is true that this build does not hit any fhr breakpoint, but rest assured that fhr is really not very important in mfing. Through the countless mf runs that I have done, I have seen that fhr is really only a luxury and unless you suck there is no run that requires you to have it. If it is your preference to have some, then just replace a couple mf sc's with fhr sc's and be done, but there is not real necessity that demands fhr. My current hammerdin has 0% fhr, and does not get owned while teleing to chaos/baal/meph and is able to recover and keep hammering before monsters can land a second hit in almost all cases; the high defense and block that comes with holy shield makes fhr very very optional. I can easily solo all the mf spots including chaos/trav/baal/nilathak without gettting destroyed unless there is a lag spike, in which case even the best fhr cannot save you. Remember also that your aura has a 20% chance to let you hammer uninteruppted even if you get hit during casting.
Now that you have seen what my build looks like, I will proceed to justify my gear decisions.
Many people tend to try to build their mf hammerdin using a setup that maintains most of the normal gear (hoto, magefist, etc) and only tweak a little bit such as ist runes in the socketed items, mf charms, and nagelrings, and occasionally such oddities as ali-baba, gull dagger, or ist'd crystal swords (these latter ones create crippling weaknesses in your character as you will no longer cast hammers fast enough to chaos/baal efficiently by yourself). Using a setup with essentially the same gear as any other hammerdin is a big inefficiency and a huge mistake for a mfing char. We introduce inefficeincy on several levels: the removal of the um runes creates a hole in our resistances that weakens us knights that cast lower resist and elemental monsters such as souls (esp ones unique ones aura enchanted with conviction), the removal of the sojs lowers our mana and reduces endurance while teleing (this guide assumes that you do not cheat, as if you cheat you might as well just bot anyways; or go watch television because you remove the thinking involved in playing the game and at least television has greater variety). Just as you wouldn't put on bvc gear and try to make a hammerdin, you SHOULDN'T put on traditional or dueling gear and try to make an mf-din; and tweaking optimized builds tends to create holes that leave much to be desired. Now you may point out that each gear choice only increases the mf by a bit and that inefficiency will not result in a huge difference since the enigma itself gives so much, but each small part counts and adds up. You will be mfing many, many games in order to find godly stuff and trade material, and each point of inefficiency is magnified hundredfold, even thousandfold over the course of your mfing runs. I suspect that many will condemn my build as sucking when compared to one that uses hoto/magefiust, but I also suspect that those people have not actually given my build very much testing or, for that matter, much thought even; however, I HAVE tested both setups and have found this latter one to be far superior. Every extra mf counts, and I have personally witnessed how my old hammerdin at 300-ish mf finds only on average 1-2 grand charms in a chaos run, while my new model finds up to 4-5 per run (I use charms in chaos runs because godly charms are a much-sought-after item and finding more gives you a greater chance to find a godly one, and chaosing is the natural mf spot for a hammerdin, as he is able to take full advantage of his vs undead bonus as well as redemption).
First of all, a gear choice that involves magefist is not going to cut it, because it neglects one of the larges and most efficeint mf boosts that you can get from a single swap: the exchange of only 20% fcr for 40% mf in chance guards. You dont lose a singel skill point and gain vast mf. Now of course you are below the fcr breakpoint. What happen? I use an ist's wizardspike to compensate. At this point you may well ask: "Jim are you smoking crack? +3 skills is huge! you will do so little damage and you're exchanging it for a measly 30% mf!". True, +3 skill is indeed a massive ~2.5k damage loss, BUT in this case, if you think carefully, Ist'd wizzardspike achieves 3 subtle goals for us: (1) it gives us mana enough to forgo the sojs while still being able to tele to high-end mf places such as baal, mephisto, andy, and the like, (2) it gives us MASSIVE resistances that allows us to replace the UM runes in our hoz and shako without dying to souls and other elemental damage monsters, (3) it allows us to achieve requisite faster cast for the replacement of the magefists. Although each individually trivial, these three factors add up to TREMENDOUS mfing power for the wizardspike and renders it a weapon that we cannot do without. The wizardspike gives us +30% mf on the wizzardspike's ist, +40% from ability to use chance guards, +40-55% from replacing an soj and an fcr ring with mf (these can range from 10% mf to a whopping 25%, depending on how hard you look and how much you are willing to spend), and another 30% from using 2 ist runes in our shako and hoz instead of ums. Now at this point you may say well i can use the ist's and nagels anyways with hoto/magefist setup, but then you are losing buffness against elemental mobs and ability to tele without jubbing or going to town; remember that although we would like to optimize our mf, we must not allow the mf to render the character itself impotent and unable to kill mf monsters quickly and efficiently, as that equates to less mf runs finished and less items found. Now for the charms, 7% mfscs are relatively cheap and are a MUST for good mfing, as using 28 of them gives us 196% mf, a force to be reckoned with. The small pause in hitting "i", clicking the item, and putting it in your cube when you happen to find a good one is made up for by having immense mf. Remember that mf works through brute force of running vast numbers of games rather than finding a lot of good items quickly, so the times you will have to do this is not as often as you think, takes less time than you think, and trips to town can be remedied by carrying an ID tome and seeing if the item is any good on the spot. _____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
ChaNgeD
Group: Members Joined: 28 Mar 2007 Posts: 61 Gold: Locked
Status: Warn: Reputation: 1
|
#2 Posted: 29 Mar 2007 09:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I guess alrite guide but you should make it more organized instead of hughe paragraphs :/ hard to read |
|
Back to top |
|
|
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#3 Posted: 03 Apr 2007 09:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
ChaNgeD wrote: | I guess alrite guide but you should make it more organized instead of hughe paragraphs :/ hard to read |
all you need to read is look at the s/s of my build if you want to make the char. the huge paragraphs are just details explaining my design choices and are really only useful if you are feeling curious or doubtful
edit - i have gotten a better ring to replace the nagel. it's a rather uncommon magic ring called the "fortuitous ring of fortune", and can have up to 40% mf.
Last edited by treezzzzz on 03 Apr 2007 09:17 am; edited 1 time in total _____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
iIntrigue
Group: Retired Moderators Joined: 25 Jan 2007 Posts: 1413 Gold: 343.82 Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 12
|
#4 Posted: 03 Apr 2007 09:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hey nice guide Treezzzz I like it
On the other hand, If you're truly mfing u should have at least 4 columns free of items IMO... I'd even take 8 lol making u loose loads of MF :\ _____________________ http://iIntrigue.net |
|
Back to top |
|
|
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#5 Posted: 03 Apr 2007 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
Aquaphire wrote: | Hey nice guide Treezzzz I like it
On the other hand, If you're truly mfing u should have at least 4 columns free of items IMO... I'd even take 8 lol making u loose loads of MF :\ |
you can just stick stuff in your cube it doesnt slow you down by very much. also it's not really that bad loads of mf since the charms are the most inefficient source of your mf anyways. _____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Evilution
Group: Members Joined: 25 Mar 2007 Posts: 386 Gold: 2.75 Clan: D3JSP
Status: Warn: Reputation: 18
|
#6 Posted: 04 Apr 2007 06:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
good work on the guide but imo i prefer to just have 250-300mf since (at least in my experience) more mf than this doesnt really help _____________________
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
AngeLexia
Group: Members Joined: 25 Feb 2007 Posts: 275 Gold: 41.09
Status: Warn: Reputation: 4
|
#7 Posted: 04 Apr 2007 06:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
treezzzzz wrote: | Aquaphire wrote: | Hey nice guide Treezzzz I like it
On the other hand, If you're truly mfing u should have at least 4 columns free of items IMO... I'd even take 8 lol making u loose loads of MF :\ |
you can just stick stuff in your cube it doesnt slow you down by very much. also it's not really that bad loads of mf since the charms are the most inefficient source of your mf anyways. |
that was what I thought first where does the stuff go? then on second thought, cube has 12 spaces, the inventory I usually just use 8 spaces , good guide though _____________________ -Gelinda
Rules Warn Faq |
|
Back to top |
|
|
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#8 Posted: 13 Apr 2007 12:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Evilution wrote: | good work on the guide but imo i prefer to just have 250-300mf since (at least in my experience) more mf than this doesnt really help |
well my old build had about 350 or so mf and now i usually find twice as many stuff. just a person opinion you are entitled to yours as well
AngeLexia wrote: | treezzzzz wrote: | Aquaphire wrote: | Hey nice guide Treezzzz I like it
On the other hand, If you're truly mfing u should have at least 4 columns free of items IMO... I'd even take 8 lol making u loose loads of MF :\ |
you can just stick stuff in your cube it doesnt slow you down by very much. also it's not really that bad loads of mf since the charms are the most inefficient source of your mf anyways. |
that was what I thought first where does the stuff go? then on second thought, cube has 12 spaces, the inventory I usually just use 8 spaces , good guide though |
cool glad you like it. gonna try it out sometime? _____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
ToMMiE
Group: Members Joined: 07 Jul 2007 Posts: 38 Gold: 0.00
Status: Warn: Reputation: 0
|
#9 Posted: 14 Jan 2008 09:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
godly mfadin guide. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Kerm
Group: Members Joined: 10 Jan 2008 Posts: 1259 Gold: Locked
Status: Warn: Reputation: 12
|
#10 Posted: 14 Jan 2008 09:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, I agree very nice Guide.
Last edited by Kerm on 14 Jan 2008 09:33 pm; edited 1 time in total _____________________ D3jsp > D2jsp |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Njaguar2k8
Group: Members Joined: 08 Jun 2008 Posts: 6 Gold: 3.50
Status: Warn: Reputation: 0
|
#11 Posted: 09 Jun 2008 07:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
very cheesy guide..
i never see any guide w/ differen builds |
|
Back to top |
|
|
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#12 Posted: 15 Jun 2008 06:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Njaguar2k8 wrote: | very cheesy guide..
i never see any guide w/ differen builds |
most builds dont use this setup. also pose a better one if you think mine is bad. _____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Kerm
Group: Members Joined: 10 Jan 2008 Posts: 1259 Gold: Locked
Status: Warn: Reputation: 12
|
#13 Posted: 15 Jun 2008 11:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
treezzzzz wrote: | Njaguar2k8 wrote: | very cheesy guide..
i never see any guide w/ differen builds |
most builds dont use this setup. also pose a better one if you think mine is bad. |
Lol for real don't criticize everybody else's unless you can make a better one. _____________________ D3jsp > D2jsp |
|
Back to top |
|
|
NiCK
Group: Members Joined: 30 Jun 2008 Posts: 10 Gold: 5.50 Clan: Zero Tolerance
Status: Warn: Reputation: 0
|
#14 Posted: 30 Jun 2008 05:01 pm Post subject: Re: Optimized MF Hammerdin Build |
|
|
treezzzzz wrote: | First of all, you may be thinking: "why a hammerdin? hammerdin doesnt achieve high mf without becoming totally gimp! I want to make a sorceress for mfing"
Many people live under the delusion that a hammerdin cannot achieve high mf at all and will become totally gimp if it tries to do so. However, one of the best mf spots of all time, the chaos sanctuary, can prove a nightmare for any sorceress, with element immunities left and right and iron maiden to kill the precious infinity merc. However, with this build, you can chaos with ease and still find great items.
Of course needless to say you should lvl to 85-ish before you spend any stats then put just enough str to wear your gear and just enough dex to achieve maximum block; and for skills you should put in points to all the normal hammerdin skills (max hammers, vigor, blessed aim, concentration, 1 into redeption, 1 into all prerequisites, rest into holy shield etc).
Using this setup, the hammerdin hits 550-600 mf and still has 80% fcr (enough for the 75 breakpoint), max block, 3k life, and 10k hammer damage (which is enough to kill almost all monsters in 2 hits anyways in a one player game). Remember that having high mf is only relevent if you are the one getting the last hit, so most of the time you will be in a game with few players. Of course notice that if you were truly devoted you could craft an ammy with stats, 5% or more fcr, and mf, and achieve even more mf by replacing the fcr ring with another nagel, but I haven't seen any ammies fitting that description so far and use a 10% fcr ring with mf instead. Now it is true that this build does not hit any fhr breakpoint, but rest assured that fhr is really not very important in mfing. Through the countless mf runs that I have done, I have seen that fhr is really only a luxury and unless you suck there is no run that requires you to have it. If it is your preference to have some, then just replace a couple mf sc's with fhr sc's and be done, but there is not real necessity that demands fhr. My current hammerdin has 0% fhr, and does not get owned while teleing to chaos/baal/meph and is able to recover and keep hammering before monsters can land a second hit in almost all cases; the high defense and block that comes with holy shield makes fhr very very optional. I can easily solo all the mf spots including chaos/trav/baal/nilathak without gettting destroyed unless there is a lag spike, in which case even the best fhr cannot save you. Remember also that your aura has a 20% chance to let you hammer uninteruppted even if you get hit during casting.
Now that you have seen what my build looks like, I will proceed to justify my gear decisions.
Many people tend to try to build their mf hammerdin using a setup that maintains most of the normal gear (hoto, magefist, etc) and only tweak a little bit such as ist runes in the socketed items, mf charms, and nagelrings, and occasionally such oddities as ali-baba, gull dagger, or ist'd crystal swords (these latter ones create crippling weaknesses in your character as you will no longer cast hammers fast enough to chaos/baal efficiently by yourself). Using a setup with essentially the same gear as any other hammerdin is a big inefficiency and a huge mistake for a mfing char. We introduce inefficeincy on several levels: the removal of the um runes creates a hole in our resistances that weakens us knights that cast lower resist and elemental monsters such as souls (esp ones unique ones aura enchanted with conviction), the removal of the sojs lowers our mana and reduces endurance while teleing (this guide assumes that you do not cheat, as if you cheat you might as well just bot anyways; or go watch television because you remove the thinking involved in playing the game and at least television has greater variety). Just as you wouldn't put on bvc gear and try to make a hammerdin, you SHOULDN'T put on traditional or dueling gear and try to make an mf-din; and tweaking optimized builds tends to create holes that leave much to be desired. Now you may point out that each gear choice only increases the mf by a bit and that inefficiency will not result in a huge difference since the enigma itself gives so much, but each small part counts and adds up. You will be mfing many, many games in order to find godly stuff and trade material, and each point of inefficiency is magnified hundredfold, even thousandfold over the course of your mfing runs. I suspect that many will condemn my build as sucking when compared to one that uses hoto/magefiust, but I also suspect that those people have not actually given my build very much testing or, for that matter, much thought even; however, I HAVE tested both setups and have found this latter one to be far superior. Every extra mf counts, and I have personally witnessed how my old hammerdin at 300-ish mf finds only on average 1-2 grand charms in a chaos run, while my new model finds up to 4-5 per run (I use charms in chaos runs because godly charms are a much-sought-after item and finding more gives you a greater chance to find a godly one, and chaosing is the natural mf spot for a hammerdin, as he is able to take full advantage of his vs undead bonus as well as redemption).
First of all, a gear choice that involves magefist is not going to cut it, because it neglects one of the larges and most efficeint mf boosts that you can get from a single swap: the exchange of only 20% fcr for 40% mf in chance guards. You dont lose a singel skill point and gain vast mf. Now of course you are below the fcr breakpoint. What happen? I use an ist's wizardspike to compensate. At this point you may well ask: "Jim are you smoking crack? +3 skills is huge! you will do so little damage and you're exchanging it for a measly 30% mf!". True, +3 skill is indeed a massive ~2.5k damage loss, BUT in this case, if you think carefully, Ist'd wizzardspike achieves 3 subtle goals for us: (1) it gives us mana enough to forgo the sojs while still being able to tele to high-end mf places such as baal, mephisto, andy, and the like, (2) it gives us MASSIVE resistances that allows us to replace the UM runes in our hoz and shako without dying to souls and other elemental damage monsters, (3) it allows us to achieve requisite faster cast for the replacement of the magefists. Although each individually trivial, these three factors add up to TREMENDOUS mfing power for the wizardspike and renders it a weapon that we cannot do without. The wizardspike gives us +30% mf on the wizzardspike's ist, +40% from ability to use chance guards, +40-55% from replacing an soj and an fcr ring with mf (these can range from 10% mf to a whopping 25%, depending on how hard you look and how much you are willing to spend), and another 30% from using 2 ist runes in our shako and hoz instead of ums. Now at this point you may say well i can use the ist's and nagels anyways with hoto/magefist setup, but then you are losing buffness against elemental mobs and ability to tele without jubbing or going to town; remember that although we would like to optimize our mf, we must not allow the mf to render the character itself impotent and unable to kill mf monsters quickly and efficiently, as that equates to less mf runs finished and less items found. Now for the charms, 7% mfscs are relatively cheap and are a MUST for good mfing, as using 28 of them gives us 196% mf, a force to be reckoned with. The small pause in hitting "i", clicking the item, and putting it in your cube when you happen to find a good one is made up for by having immense mf. Remember that mf works through brute force of running vast numbers of games rather than finding a lot of good items quickly, so the times you will have to do this is not as often as you think, takes less time than you think, and trips to town can be remedied by carrying an ID tome and seeing if the item is any good on the spot. |
oh geezz i had one of these on ladder last season xD |
|
Back to top |
|
|
nightmare100
Group: Members Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 11 Gold: 6.00
Status: Warn: Reputation: 0
|
#15 Posted: 07 Aug 2008 09:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Great guide but make sure you have room in ur stash -.-picking up drops will be a pain in the neck. _____________________ My account ond2 is xp-nightmare. You can notify me of anything on that account |
|
Back to top |
|
|
nightmare100
Group: Members Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 11 Gold: 6.00
Status: Warn: Reputation: 0
|
#16 Posted: 07 Aug 2008 10:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Great guide but make sure you have room in ur stash -.-picking up drops will be a pain in the neck. _____________________ My account ond2 is xp-nightmare. You can notify me of anything on that account |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Raph
Group: Members Joined: 05 Aug 2008 Posts: 139 Gold: 3.50 Clan: HoD II
Status: Warn: Reputation: 2
|
#17 Posted: 07 Aug 2008 10:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Nice guide bro, |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Crai
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Jul 2008 Posts: 717 Gold: Locked
Status: Warn: Reputation: 14
|
#18 Posted: 07 Aug 2008 10:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
every hdin uses same build..
nothing new |
|
Back to top |
|
|
treezzzzz
Group: Scammer Joined: 02 Mar 2007 Posts: 31031 Gold: Locked Clan: Transformers
Status: Warn: Reputation: 50
|
#19 Posted: 06 Jan 2009 07:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
seems like the picture is broken.
here's a new one:
_____________________
Join Clan Transformers Today!! (links below)
Clan Forums Recruitment Thread |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Littletroll
Group: Members Joined: 22 Jul 2008 Donor: Posts: 481 Gold: 4361.80 Clan: HoD II
Status: Warn: Reputation: 28
|
#20 Posted: 07 Jan 2009 09:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
treezzzzz wrote: | seems like the picture is broken.
here's a new one:
|
you could free up 2 more spots by taking out the tp tome and putting a row of tp's on your belt ... you dont rlly need 4 slots of pots and by using the belt you can instacast a tp without switching skill/opening inv to do so _____________________
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum You cannot attach files in this forum You cannot download files in this forum
|
D3jsp is proudly powered by phpBB © 2.0 Theme and Forum by tramway
|